Expanding the Information Superhighway: Where Will The 5G Journey Take Us?

Cellular technology has advanced from text messaging capabilities to high-speed internet within a short timeframe, so what’s next? What new wonders will our phones and other IoT devices be capable of in the coming years?

In this episode of Connect we’re joined by Michelle James, Vice President of Strategic Industry Associations, CTIA (aka “The Wireless Association”), who shares her insight and experience in the telecom industry from its early analog days to the present-day progression toward 5G. We’ll examine how the telecom ecosystem has expanded over the years to include more manufacturers, network operators, app developers, content creators and other stakeholders. We’ll also explore why more “things” are transmitting data than ever before—including everything from onboard automotive systems and intelligent traffic signals to smart agriculture telematics and IoT-based waste management.

5G technology promises to unleash new, game-changing possibilities. There’s no doubt that it will have a profound effect on IoT, but what can businesses and consumers expect? Join us as we do our best to enlighten you and take the on-ramp to the new, information superhighway.

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Transcript

Scott Dunn (00:06):

From AI and deep learning to cybersecurity and IOT, keeping up with technology can be challenging.

James Marcella (00:16):

Our podcast is not just about helping you keep up, but we're inviting you to the precipice of what we now know is possible.

Scott Dunn (00:23):

Join us as we interview industry luminaries and trailblazers to hear how they're leveraging technology, navigating pitfalls, and predicting the future.

James Marcella (00:34):

Together we'll explore today's most timely topics, combining human imagination and intelligent technology to discover new solutions.

Scott Dunn (00:47):

I am happy to introduce my co-host, Mr. James Marcella, security expert and industry association leader.

James Marcella (00:55):

And it's a pleasure to introduce Scott Dunn, technology innovator and award-winning speaker.

Scott Dunn (01:03):

And this is Connect, a bimonthly podcast from Axis Communications.

James Marcella (01:14):

On today's episode, I'll be speaking to Michelle James about technology deployment and the role of cellular technology. Welcome to the show, Michelle.

Michelle James (01:23):

Thanks for having me.

James Marcella (01:24):

Well, it's good to have you here. Why don't you take a moment, introduce yourself to our listeners.

Michelle James (01:28):

Michelle James, vice President Strategic Industry Programs here at CTIA. That's a mouthful. What we work on are developing programs that are usable or consumable, if you will, for the entire marketplace as well as for our member companies. We do various programs relative to smart cities, deployments, and work on other aspects of various things related to the supply chain as well.

James Marcella (01:55):

We'll love to hear more about those programs a little bit later, a little foreshadowing here. But before that, I'd love to hear how you got into the telecom industry and how you've seen it evolve over those years.

Michelle James (02:07):

Yeah, it's been quite the journey. I like to tell people that I was pre-G when I first started in the industry. I started with Nokia Mobile Phones basically in 1996. I will say back then in the US not many people knew who Nokia was when we first started. I still had analog product when I first came into the wireless industry as the industry moved to 2G, 3G, 4G, and now going into 5G. So, I've been very fortunate. On one hand I know where all the dead bodies are, but also at the same time I've seen a lot of companies and people sort of grow up in an industry that was created. And if you look at the whole timeline, the history of our industry, that's not that long ago compared to some of the technology that we're able to enable based on wireless technology today.

(03:02):

So, I'm really grateful for having that perspective in terms of being really early days, really not knowing what was possible or what was to come. Our tagline at Nokia was connecting people, and I've always enjoyed connecting people in terms of groups and creating a sense of community, if you will. And I will say there's a lot of that sense of community in the wireless industry. A lot of people came into this industry and have stayed in this industry much like myself as well as new folks who have come in and have been able to take advantage of a really great rich history, but in a very short timeframe compared to what we were able to create from a connectivity standpoint.

James Marcella (03:44):

And you mentioned community, if you think about it today, mobile technology really is the ultimate enabler for a community, right?

Michelle James (03:54):

That's right. That's right.

James Marcella (03:55):

There's so much that happens online. So, started a manufacturer ultimately worked your way into your position and where you're at now at CTIA. And from as I understand it, CTIA really works to enable people and leading the 21st century connected life, right? So why don't you tell our listeners, well, first of all, I'm not even sure what CTIA stands for. So, what does that stand for, both figuratively and literally?

Michelle James (04:21):

Yeah, so it's a little bit outdated. So the association, the Wireless Industry Trade Association, CTIA has been around since 1985. So, CTIA stand or stood for Cellular Telecommunications Industry Association, but today it's just known as CTIA, The Wireless Association. So, we are the ecosystem for all things mobile. So, network operators, the manufacturers, the app developers, the content developers, basically all of the entire ecosystem that touches anything connected through cellular networks. For us, basically our community consists of any company or stakeholder that's involved with a LTE chip for example, or a 5G chip. So, those have now expanded beyond your traditional smartphones to also include IOT. And I know we're going to talk a little bit more about that today in terms of the future and what that looks like. But yeah, so basically everything that has a chip in it is in our community.

James Marcella (05:28):

So, who are some of the major players outside of the cellular industry that are stakeholders within CTIA? Obviously you're on an Axis podcast. We're a proud member of CTIA. Who are some of the other companies that our listeners might not associate with cellular technology in the connected community?

Michelle James (05:51):

So, I talked a little bit about IOT. So again, we have grown to expect connectivity in our relationship with our things that are transmitting data in some way, shape, or form. Some of it's very simple data from a connection point. Some of it's very heavy data, right? So, we've got folks that are involved in telematics that are inside of cars that now are sending signals to intelligent traffic management systems, for example. So, companies who would not have traditionally seen themselves as wireless companies, so they could be in the automotive space, they could be in the onboard systems of systems of the automotive industry. We've got folks that are in farming. We've got folks that are putting telematics inside of John Deere equipments that are now transmitting data for smart agriculture.

(06:44):

We've got folks that are making dog collars with sensors in them, right? We've got sensors that are now going into waste management where they're monitoring different points along a route. For example, we've got GPS and every kind of industry fleet management for traceability of their fleets for whatever services they're providing, right? So, whether it's private or public. So, there's a lot of touchpoints relative to connectivity that's creating more efficiencies and greater information for various industry verticals to touch our space in ways that we probably never imagined in 1985, which is where we are today.

James Marcella (07:27):

Sure, yeah, I mean it's probably easier to state or more difficult to find out what industries wouldn't be impacted by these technologies, right?

Michelle James (07:37):

It's hard to think of one.

James Marcella (07:39):

Yeah, nothing comes to mind for me. So, talking about technology and 5G seems to be what everybody hears about, right? And we are in this transition from 4G to 5G, is that a straight breakup or are they still going to be friends?

Michelle James (07:57):

So again, I've been here since analog days. It's an evolution. There's a reason they call it an evolution. I think every generation of technology in terms of the connectivity, so the wireless cellular technology itself has brought different benefits and aspect with every generation. The amazing thing with cellular technology with each generation, all of the security and infrastructure and key learnings from the generation prior are all fundamental to the next generation in terms of development. I would say if we think about it from a 1G, so that was just us going to a digital platform, right? So moving from an analog to digital technology in terms of cellular. In 2G, we had text messaging, right there were other things that came with 2G, but that was the notable difference between just voice over a digital network, moving to text over digital networks with 2G.

(08:59):

I will tell you sort of funny side note that I said in, I said in meetings for what felt like years, probably in light years it was months, but nonetheless, where there were whole groups of people that would say, "Nobody wants to text on a screen that's this big," right? And now can you even imagine not having that capability? People look at their phones, I think some average of, I don't know, 72 times an hour. Can you imagine not having those short texts in your pocket? So, that's what 2G brought and 3G, we brought other data like streaming music and other the connectivity basically to the internet, right? So, now we've got the internet in your pocket for the first time in 3G. And then 4G brought additional applications that needed much more bandwidth relative to 3G's technology in 4G, which basically empowered faster streaming services, for example.

(10:00):

It's been able to impact business in a completely different way, 4G connectivity. And now 5G, this is our next generation, so we're in the middle of building what I like to call kind of we're building a superhighway. We didn't know when 2G, 3G, 4G were being built, all of what the innovation community was going to take advantage of each of those generations, right? So, we're in the process of building that superhighway. This one's really, really exciting and I think definitely going to be a game changer, particularly on sectors like automotive manufacturing, for example, where you need a lot of data in intelligent traffic management systems, in the speed and latency for other things, including smart tolling across the country, other aspects relative to just manufacturing and design, where massive amounts of data are needed for that kind of development. From a consumer standpoint, I might not be downloading that Netflix movie any faster than I thought I was with 4G, although I would argue you technically probably are, but not necessarily visible to the naked eye so much.

(11:15):

But the engineers will certainly share with you it is much faster in 5G. But some of the sweet spot for 5G is really going to be about how it changes and transforms communities based on other kinds of connectivity that are now going to be available, such as intelligent traffic management systems. You've got all kinds of navigation apps that are now transmitting all kinds of some binary data, some deep dive data. You've got all kinds of, like I mentioned, the traffic management systems, tolling, streetlights, smart streetlights. So, now we're talking about things that touch also sustainability where they can actually have smart meters on the streetlights. We've got water management systems, we've got entire advanced metering systems for the utility grid that is able to now transmit data. Instead of having folks come out to read your meter, those meters have gotten smarter and therefore that data is now being transmitted back to central hubs, so that better and smarter decision making can be made.

(12:24):

So every facet, for example of a city, whether it's transportation, utilities, smart public services, education, all connectivity data points will be a benefactor in some way, shape or form, whether they're using 4G or 5G. My personal opinion is we're going to be on 4G in parallel to the build out of the superhighway of 5G for a very long time. What that date is, I have no idea, but there's a lot of solutions today that don't necessarily need or rely on the bandwidth that's now available in 5G or will be available in 5G in many areas. They're still just making their way to 4G.

James Marcella (13:06):

And that's probably the way every transition went, right? There was a period of when both of them were in running at the same time, and ultimately the newer technology phases out the older technology-

Michelle James (13:18):

That's right.

James Marcella (13:18):

Over many years.

Michelle James (13:20):

That's right.

James Marcella (13:21):

It's really interesting. I never looked at the transition from one to two to three to four, now moving to five as being more than just bandwidth. To me it was always, oh, it's more bandwidth. But the way you described it, we're actually adding new services with each of these as well as expanding the bandwidth that we're able to deliver these solutions on.

Michelle James (13:43):

And I would again reiterate, with each deployment of each generation, even the network operators who even just last year alone spent more than $34 billion building out their networks, they don't always know what the actual golden application is going to be or the best use case of that technology deployment. Not a blind leap of faith, if you will, but at the end of the day, they're building it so that the innovators and the rest of the mobile ecosystem I was describing, other members inside CTIA are able to take that technology and then solve for other real world problems because that's superhighway or the investment has been made and the infrastructure, so that innovation is actually possible.

James Marcella (14:31):

I can imagine that history shows that it's not necessarily a leap of faith because every time you've built it out bigger and better, the industry has risen to the challenge and come out with new and exciting and beneficial applications to run on that infrastructure. I want to step back, you had mentioned heavy applications. What does the word in your terminology heavy mean? Is that bandwidth intensive?

Michelle James (14:55):

Yeah. So, bandwidth intensive relative to the quantity of data that's being processed. So, if it's streaming 8K video up and down, and you need the highest level clarity in terms of that transmission, you need the biggest pipe possible to transmit and the lowest latency. And if you are doing edge computing, for example, which is basically creating a network where the data is close to the use case, right? Versus going all the way back to a central office inside of a network and then transmitting back that data or that computation, if you will, you need a big pipe for that. So, I call it a pipe, but you need the superhighway to be as big as possible in order to manage that computation, both just the data gathering, but also the actual computation in terms of output. The whole idea is to take that data and do something with the data, right? Or that data then becomes the impetus for some other decision making, whether it's automated decision making or human decision making.

James Marcella (16:01):

5G is always touted, at least in our industry, and I'm sure many others as a precursor or let's just say a foundation for Smart City, how would you define a smart city and how is CTIA collaborating with membership to enable smart cities?

Michelle James (16:22):

Yeah. So, I think just edit the question a little bit. The city can be smart whether or not they're on 5G, right? So, even if they're migrating from something that's maybe a very manual process, we saw a lot of this coming through COVID, right? So, where city offices or municipalities were still doing very manual processes relative to managing some of the data, whether it's data for their services or filing of permits, or it was just very a lot of human wasn't actually digitized, so that was sort of raised in awareness. Maybe they knew they weren't fully digitized, but the need for becoming digitized in an environment where it was contactless, they needed to rely on that data to reside some. So, there's a big push for that. So, that wouldn't be a 5G effort necessarily, but just for us, I would say for smart cities, I think the industry has kind this, again, this is my personal opinion, but I think the industry has kind of done itself a little bit of a disservice by coining the phrase "Smart City" because it's not really a defined term.

(17:33):

We really focus in a lot of the work that we do at CTIA and our working groups, we really focus on deployments that are helping cities on their journey to becoming smarter. Whether they're using a 4G network or they're just digitizing or they're moving all the way to a 5G solution, for example. For us, it's a geography of IOT with the promise of delivering efficiencies. And again, the efficiencies surrounding whatever problems that they're trying to solve. And every municipality across the country are solving for different things, right? Not every city has a crime problem. Not every city has a water issue. Not every city has transportation congestion, right? So, different cities have different priorities based on those who live, work and play in those cities. And so, really taking what technology is available, 4G and or 5G and prioritizing based on what they want their smarter journey to be, relative to what they're serving their community, right? So, serving their business community, serving their residents, serving their tourists, whatever that might be in terms of their own individual municipality or personality priorities.

James Marcella (18:53):

I agree with you. I think it makes a lot more sense to be more specific in our terminology around what these solutions are doing. At Axis, we started off talking Smart City, and we do a lot in different areas, but we really started to focus on what we called Safe City because a lot of our solutions were geared towards life safety and security. So, again, just sort of one subset of an overall Smart City umbrella term. This is probably a great time to define IOT. You and I have been using that throughout our conversation today. Obviously, we probably both know what IOT OT stands for, but how would you define IOT?

Michelle James (19:33):

Yeah, the funny thing is I think that the engineers haven't actually all landed on exactly what the engineering definition. So, this is not an engineering definition, but IOT obviously stands for the Internet of Things. What basically it is a connectivity between anything and the internet. So, some data point is transmissible from a thing, and again, for us in cellular, we're focused on the things that have LTE or cellular connectivity. But IOT could also be Bluetooth, IOT could be other wireless technologies that are not cellular. They run sort of in parallel with us. Lots of our cellular devices also have other wireless connectivity or other kinds of chips that are creating a different connectivity point. Bluetooth, wifi, NFC, other technology IOT also available for us. We focus on the cellular IOT devices.

James Marcella (20:37):

So I can see, speaking of other wireless technologies, I can see Bluetooth being the annoying little brother that you really don't have to worry about. But wifi, is that a competing technology in some cases? Obviously complimentary in a lot of cases, but how about competition wise for almost any of these applications you've spoken about?

Michelle James (20:58):

The funny thing is, so CTIA has a lot of what we call liaison agreements with other associations where we can work with them. So, the Bluetooth Association as well as the Wifi Alliance. So, we work with them. Particularly where we've got test plans where there's multiple chips inside of a single device in our case, cellular focused, but they also have a wifi component to it, right? So, I can do wifi from my phone, I can do wifi from my laptop, I can do wifi from other things, routers and modems, for example, and we certify all of those because they also have cellular chips in them as well. So, we have a relationship with wifi. I will tell you again, because I've been in the industry for so long, they were probably seen as competing technologies before, but I don't think that it feels like we're competing today.

(21:54):

I will say from a spectrum standpoint, and I don't really do policy, we've amazing people here at CTIA that work on the policy side of the house. From a policy stand, we absolutely lead with licensed spectrum, which is cellular. Wifi is open. There are limitations with, and this is not a competitive statement, but there are limitations with wifi, so you have to be in close proximity for your connectivity and cellular you are in a much, much bigger, broader place relative to where your connectivity is available. And there's different levels of security I think the engineers would probably speak to, but it's a proximity difference for wifi, and it requires, even if you were using it for even a similar cellular application or solution, you would require more nodes, if that makes sense. So, more connection points, and with every connection point between one to two, to two to three all the way down, whatever it is that you are trying to create a longer, much broader connection using wifi, there are vulnerabilities that come with that movement versus cellular me talking to the tower with my device or sensor, it's just different.

James Marcella (23:20):

Yeah, I'm right with you on that idea and that statement. So, you mentioned building the superhighway. Is that the biggest obstacle that the industry faces, your industry? Or are there other obstacles that probably there's always regulatory obstacles potentially, but what are the biggest obstacles that the cellular industry faces?

Michelle James (23:41):

Well, if I look at it through the lens of smart cities, so I think I can't necessarily fix city hall. I think that most cities have told me that their RFP processes are broken or are not modern. And so, I think if there's anything that we can do to help them with that process, even if we can't change the process, again, it's leaning in on things like the Maturity Model. If we can give cities and all cities can use it without us, I don't even need to be part of the conversation, but whether it's use cases or the tools like The Maturity Model, which is basically an assessment so a city can see how actually smart am I today? If you don't know where you are, you don't know where you're going. So, if they're still in the decision making process relative to prioritizing inside of the verticals that we're touching or we think that we have the best opportunities relative to cellular solutions to offer cities, we want them to be able to use that to get through their procurement process a little easier if that's possible.

(24:51):

We want industry to work a little better together. It's really easy for us to say, oh, cities work in silos. Well, I would argue also industry works in silos because the chip manufacturer needs to talk to the end unit or the module manufacturer, who needs to talk to the deployment folks, who literally needs to have conversations with the deployment people, right? And they're oftentimes very different companies and certainly different personalities. I think the closer I can close the gap relative from the chip all the way to the folks that I affectionately say, the folks who dig the holes and climb the poles and actually put the stuff up, right? If I can close the gap in that arena, then I think we can be better educators for the stakeholders in terms, because at the end of the day, they have to have all of it, but we need to have certain starting points. We need to have education. We need to have tools that they can lean into in an agnostic way so that they can just make the best, most informed decisions for themselves.

James Marcella (26:00):

Why don't we finish off with a question about the future? Are we going to continue to just see Gs, the next iteration of Gs and until ad nauseum until forever infinity? No, really, as you've mentioned many times, you've been in industry for a long time. You've been in it since it was analog. I have too. I think one of my first phones was an Nokia phone way back when in the eighties, and clearly we've both seen from our own personal perspectives, the way they've changed our lives and things that we can do today with our phones that God, we couldn't even imagine doing way back when. Any insights as to what are some future capabilities that we have to look forward to?

Michelle James (26:44):

If we think about, when I was talking about the leap between 2G, 3G, 4G, and now going into 5G, just the sheer quantity of data that's going to be available in ways and places that we never would've imagined we even needed it. Remember, we didn't think we needed text messages on our phone. Nobody believed that we needed the internet in our pocket. But if I think about that on a super grand scale, yes, things, the sexy headlines of today in terms of autonomous vehicles, the modernization of the grid, the move towards EV and all the data that's now going to be required to even manage that, the new ways that we need to manage the grid relative to going to a more EV focused environment, for example, the distribution of energy is going to change almost overnight in some places. I think we've already started to see that, right?

(27:52):

So, all of the needs relative to major industry sectors in both the management, the monitoring, the safety and security, and also the data management of making sure that we're able to deliver on all these sort of really big sort of grand ideas is going to require technology. Cellular is going to be a big component of that, not the only, it's going to take a village of wireless technologies, plural. Yeah, cellular is a great rich history relative to its safety and security in terms of being a generations of technology that continues to get better over time and more robust over time. So, what is that exactly? I don't know. I mean, I think all of it's going to happen in time, and then I think we're going to have some surprises we didn't count on.

James Marcella (28:50):

Well, Michelle, thank you. I learned a lot and I really want to thank you for your time.

Michelle James (28:54):

Oh, my pleasure. Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it.

James Marcella (29:05):

Cellular technology continues to advance and it's exciting to think where the superhighway will take us next. I'm James Marcella. Thanks for joining us on Connect, an Axis Communications Podcast.

Scott Dunn (29:18):

Thanks for listening to the Connect Podcast.

James Marcella (29:21):

The Connect podcast is produced in collaboration with Gusto, a matter company.

Scott Dunn (29:26):

Our producer and story developer is Jeanette Harris Quartz with support from Gabe Gerzon, Chris Shanelaris, and Charlotte Randall.

James Marcella (29:35):

Maya Laperle is our writer.

Scott Dunn (29:37):

Kyle Faneuff is our motion graphics designer.

James Marcella (29:40):

And Tim Bradley is our executive producer.

Scott Dunn (29:43):

Finally, for more information about Axis Communications, please visit our website at www.axis.com.